Reincarnation in Islam

Discussion on doctrinal issues
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kmaherali
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote:To Admin and kmaherali,
You people did not answered my above post. Who is right regarding reincarnation, Admin or Pir Shams?
Pir Shams wrote and posted by Admin," Brother, nobody can come to life after dying".
First of all, a slight correction. This was stated by Pir Sadardeen in Saloko Nano:

satgur kahere: ujad kheddaa to feer vase
ane neerdhanee-aa dhanvant hoy
pann ek acha(n)bo aa(n)khee-e
bhaai muvaa na jeeve koi re.....................75

The True Guide says: The deserted village will rehabilitate and the poor will become rich. However, there is one astonishing sight. Brother, nobody can come to life(physical) after dying.

http://ismaili.net/heritage/node/22993

As you can read above, the verse is alluding to conditions of the present life - deserted village, the rich and the poor. Hence coming to life means no one can come to the same physical body of this life after dying.

But reincarnation is about taking birth in another body - not the present one.
shivaathervedi_2
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote:To Admin and kmaherali,
You people did not answered my above post. Who is right regarding reincarnation, Admin or Pir Shams?
Pir Shams wrote and posted by Admin," Brother, nobody can come to life after dying".
First of all, a slight correction. This was stated by Pir Sadardeen in Saloko Nano:

satgur kahere: ujad kheddaa to feer vase
ane neerdhanee-aa dhanvant hoy
pann ek acha(n)bo aa(n)khee-e
bhaai muvaa na jeeve koi re.....................75

The True Guide says: The deserted village will rehabilitate and the poor will become rich. However, there is one astonishing sight. Brother, nobody can come to life(physical) after dying.

http://ismaili.net/heritage/node/22993

As you can read above, the verse is alluding to conditions of the present life - deserted village, the rich and the poor. Hence coming to life means no one can come to the same physical body of this life after dying.

But reincarnation is about taking birth in another body - not the present one.
Pir Saheb has explained the Islamic law of life and death. In this part of Ginan there is comparison;
UJJAR KHEDA TOU PHIR VASEY
ANEY NIRDHANA DHANVANT HOYA
The deserted village will rehabilitate and the poor will become rich.
BUT
PUNN EKK ACHHA(N)MBU AA KAHIYE(N)
BHAI MUVA NA JIVEY KOI
There is an astonishing side brother that no one will come to life after death.
This is negation of rebirth or reincarnation.
Please read again the reply of MSMS to Count Paro on reincarnation. Imam's reply was satisfactory and according to Islamic Laws.
shivaathervedi_2
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote: Other millions as you quoted were negligible that's why neglected by scientists.
These 2000 cases out of 7.5 billions does not fit in the reincarnation category, because that happened only once in the life of these persons, where as reincarnation philosophy says about 184,000 cycles. Let me ask you, does a person came in human form in first attempt or he passed through 184,000 cycles then took form of a human?
It is practically impossible to conduct thorough research on every case. There is no time or resources available. However a sample of 2000+ is statistically significant to conclude that remembrance of past lives does occur in the lives of young children.

!84,000 is just a figurative expression indicating many cycles. It is not exact. Even if the recall of previous existence happened in one existence it is significant to prove the concept of reincarnation. It does not necessarily have to happen in many lives.


You wrote,"However a sample of 2000+ is statistically significant to conclude that remembrance of past lives does occur in the lives of young children".
Why only in young children and not adults? I can not recall my past and I am sure neither you.

You mentioned,"184,000 is just a figurative expression indicating many cycles". If this number is figurative then why it exits unnecessarily in Ismaili literature. Once before you also discarded the Ginanic figures by two satadari Pirs. One Pir Saheb quoted 124,000 Paigambers and other 180,000 Paibambers in their Ginans and you came up with figurative formula, what a easy formula!!
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Post by Admin »

shivaathervedi wrote: He keeps banning and grounding other members, now he shall ban himself for two weeks as he is doing with others.
Your posting has been deleted. I will not repeating again and again the reasons your posts are deleted.
kmaherali
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote:PUNN EKK ACHHA(N)MBU AA KAHIYE(N)
BHAI MUVA NA JIVEY KOI
There is an astonishing side brother that no one will come to life after death.
This is negation of rebirth or reincarnation.
Please read again the reply of MSMS to Count Paro on reincarnation. Imam's reply was satisfactory and according to Islamic Laws.
According to your logic it is a negation of rebirth. You are saying that there is no life after death. However, even if you do not accept reincarnation, there is still rebirth in the higher spheres according to MSMS quoted by you.

Hence the phrase could only mean that there is no coming to this life after death.
kmaherali
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote:You wrote,"However a sample of 2000+ is statistically significant to conclude that remembrance of past lives does occur in the lives of young children".
Why only in young children and not adults? I can not recall my past and I am sure neither you.

You mentioned,"184,000 is just a figurative expression indicating many cycles". If this number is figurative then why it exits unnecessarily in Ismaili literature. Once before you also discarded the Ginanic figures by two satadari Pirs. One Pir Saheb quoted 124,000 Paigambers and other 180,000 Paibambers in their Ginans and you came up with figurative formula, what a easy formula!!
It does not happen to adults in normal circumstances because their minds are overcome by events and experiences of this life. But for very young children their minds have not been overcome by present life experiences.

However those who have made progress in Ibadat have been able to get visions of their previous lives. Also those who have had near death experiences have had visons of their previous lives.

Ginans are allegorical and hence one may interpret them allegorically. Hence figurative expressions are valid.
shivaathervedi_2
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote:PUNN EKK ACHHA(N)MBU AA KAHIYE(N)
BHAI MUVA NA JIVEY KOI
There is an astonishing side brother that no one will come to life after death.
This is negation of rebirth or reincarnation.
Please read again the reply of MSMS to Count Paro on reincarnation. Imam's reply was satisfactory and according to Islamic Laws.
According to your logic it is a negation of rebirth. You are saying that there is no life after death. However, even if you do not accept reincarnation, there is still rebirth in the higher spheres according to MSMS quoted by you.

Hence the phrase could only mean that there is no coming to this life after death.
You wrote," Hence the phrase could only mean that there is no coming to this life after death". So you admit there is no second coming of a soul on earth. Means no reincarnation in other body.
Islam, Judaism, and christianty does not believe in reincarnation.
shivaathervedi_2
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote:You wrote,"However a sample of 2000+ is statistically significant to conclude that remembrance of past lives does occur in the lives of young children".
Why only in young children and not adults? I can not recall my past and I am sure neither you.

You mentioned,"184,000 is just a figurative expression indicating many cycles". If this number is figurative then why it exits unnecessarily in Ismaili literature. Once before you also discarded the Ginanic figures by two satadari Pirs. One Pir Saheb quoted 124,000 Paigambers and other 180,000 Paibambers in their Ginans and you came up with figurative formula, what a easy formula!!
It does not happen to adults in normal circumstances because their minds are overcome by events and experiences of this life. But for very young children their minds have not been overcome by present life experiences.

However those who have made progress in Ibadat have been able to get visions of their previous lives. Also those who have had near death experiences have had visons of their previous lives.

Ginans are allegorical and hence one may interpret them allegorically. Hence figurative expressions are valid.
But those adults were also children. Why every child on surface of earth not coming up with any past history or events. These few cases in comparison to 7.5 billions are cases of neurology or neurosis. I gave example of Zehra Fona and in modern era chip, sensor, and internet technology can do lot of magic.
You wrote," Ginans are allegorical.....", are you not opening a Pandora's Box.

Are Dus Avtars, Jugs, Kalaps, Harishchandra, Tara Rani, krishna, Rama, Shiva, are in allegorical forms? Admin help!
One Pir wrote 124,000 and other wrote 180,000 Paigambers, who is correct?
Please don't be annoyed, these figures are from Ginan books.

Regarding your advice, sit in bandagi and experience past life, let me tell you, when I asked missionaries such questions, the reply was same, sit in bandagi and find. I tried and tried result nothing;
KOUN JIYEY GA TERI ZULF KE SAR HONNEY TAK
kmaherali
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote: You wrote," Hence the phrase could only mean that there is no coming to this life after death". So you admit there is no second coming of a soul on earth. Means no reincarnation in other body.
Islam, Judaism, and christianty does not believe in reincarnation.
I meant no coming back in the same body, however there may be coming back in another body and in another time, just as there s coming back in the higher spheres.
shivaathervedi_2
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote: You wrote," Hence the phrase could only mean that there is no coming to this life after death". So you admit there is no second coming of a soul on earth. Means no reincarnation in other body.
Islam, Judaism, and christianty does not believe in reincarnation.
I meant no coming back in the same body, however there may be coming back in another body and in another time, just as there s coming back in the higher spheres.
You wrote,"I meant no coming back in the same body, however there may be coming back in another body and in another time". You are playing both sides. Your this statement is in favor of reincarnation, may be coming back shows you are not sure!
Coming back in the higher sphere does not involve any body but that will be higher spiritual sphere.
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote:[You wrote,"I meant no coming back in the same body, however there may be coming back in another body and in another time". You are playing both sides. Your this statement is in favor of reincarnation, may be coming back shows you are not sure!
Coming back in the higher sphere does not involve any body but that will be higher spiritual sphere.
I am very sure. There is a difference between coming back in the same body and coming back in another body which can be the physical body as in reincarnation or astral body in the higher spheres.

The Peer is alluding to the coming back in this body not the other rebirths.

If he meant no coming back at all it would imply that there is no rebirth at all even in the higher spheres.
shivaathervedi_2
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote:[You wrote,"I meant no coming back in the same body, however there may be coming back in another body and in another time". You are playing both sides. Your this statement is in favor of reincarnation, may be coming back shows you are not sure!
Coming back in the higher sphere does not involve any body but that will be higher spiritual sphere.
I am very sure. There is a difference between coming back in the same body and coming back in another body which can be the physical body as in reincarnation or astral body in the higher spheres.

The Peer is alluding to the coming back in this body not the other rebirths.

If he meant no coming back at all it would imply that there is no rebirth at all even in the higher spheres.
There is a difference in between physical body and astral body.
In sufism an astral body is called JISM E LATIF and physical body is called JISM E KASEEF. Latif means light or delicate and Kaseef means heavy or opaque. When Jism e latif is free from clutches of worldly affairs it won't come back and take the bodily form again to be chained. Some sufis have explained, higher spiritual sphere means to become angels and there are degrees or stages in angelic world. In one of his Farman MSMS said 'this world is like a prison'. Therefore why an intelligent person would like to go back in jail!
kmaherali
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote: There is a difference in between physical body and astral body.
In sufism an astral body is called JISM E LATIF and physical body is called JISM E KASEEF. Latif means light or delicate and Kaseef means heavy or opaque. When Jism e latif is free from clutches of worldly affairs it won't come back and take the bodily form again to be chained. Some sufis have explained, higher spiritual sphere means to become angels and there are degrees or stages in angelic world. In one of his Farman MSMS said 'this world is like a prison'. Therefore why an intelligent person would like to go back in jail!
The Ginan states that no one can come to life after death. Notwithstanding the difference between physical body and astral body, there is life in the astral body. Hence if according to the verse of the Ginan, you are negating reincarnation, you are also negating rebirth in higher spheres.

No one should have the aspiration to come back in the physical form. I agree it is an imprisonment. Nevertheless it can happen depending upon the state of your soul and the unfulfilled desires in the material life.
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote: But those adults were also children. Why every child on surface of earth not coming up with any past history or events. These few cases in comparison to 7.5 billions are cases of neurology or neurosis. I gave example of Zehra Fona and in modern era chip, sensor, and internet technology can do lot of magic.
The fact that the recall does not happen to everyone does not negate the theory of reincarnation. So long as it happens to a significant number and verified scientifically through modern research, proves the theory. Did you read the article?
shivaathervedi wrote: You wrote," Ginans are allegorical.....", are you not opening a Pandora's Box.

Are Dus Avtars, Jugs, Kalaps, Harishchandra, Tara Rani, krishna, Rama, Shiva, are in allegorical forms? Admin help!
One Pir wrote 124,000 and other wrote 180,000 Paigambers, who is correct?
Please don't be annoyed, these figures are from Ginan books.
This is per MSMS's guidance that there can be many meanings for a Ginan. If you consider the figures as only figurative expressions, then there are no problems. However if you consider them literally, then there is a conflict.
shivaathervedi wrote: Regarding your advice, sit in bandagi and experience past life, let me tell you, when I asked missionaries such questions, the reply was same, sit in bandagi and find. I tried and tried result nothing;
KOUN JIYEY GA TERI ZULF KE SAR HONNEY TAK
These experiences cannot be demanded but are given as a gift. But there have been cases of people having the experiences of past lives.

There is a book written by an Ismaili Azmina Suleman who has given a detailed account of her past lives in her NDE (near death experience).
kmaherali
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Post by kmaherali »

kmaherali wrote:There is a book written by an Ismaili Azmina Suleman who has given a detailed account of her past lives in her NDE (near death experience).
More information about the book is given at:

https://www.amazon.ca/Passage-Eternity- ... ewpoints=1

Azmina Suleman's in-depth near-death experience is a treasure of a spiritual read. Islamic near-death accounts are rather rare in the literature, and this account from a Shia Ismaili Muslim adds a significant dimension to near-death experience accounts. Her 2-1/2 page description of her union with God (pp. 105-107) alone is worth the price of the book!
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote: There is a difference in between physical body and astral body.
In sufism an astral body is called JISM E LATIF and physical body is called JISM E KASEEF. Latif means light or delicate and Kaseef means heavy or opaque. When Jism e latif is free from clutches of worldly affairs it won't come back and take the bodily form again to be chained. Some sufis have explained, higher spiritual sphere means to become angels and there are degrees or stages in angelic world. In one of his Farman MSMS said 'this world is like a prison'. Therefore why an intelligent person would like to go back in jail!
The Ginan states that no one can come to life after death. Notwithstanding the difference between physical body and astral body, there is life in the astral body. Hence if according to the verse of the Ginan, you are negating reincarnation, you are also negating rebirth in higher spheres.

No one should have the aspiration to come back in the physical form. I agree it is an imprisonment. Nevertheless it can happen depending upon the state of your soul and the unfulfilled desires in the material life.
The term BIRTH can not be used for soul. Soul do not take birth. It is a creation of God and exists from primordial time. The soul is ordered by God to adopt a body according to His will.
When soul leaves body after prescribed time can not come back on its own for fulfillment of left over desires.
shivaathervedi_2
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote: But those adults were also children. Why every child on surface of earth not coming up with any past history or events. These few cases in comparison to 7.5 billions are cases of neurology or neurosis. I gave example of Zehra Fona and in modern era chip, sensor, and internet technology can do lot of magic.
The fact that the recall does not happen to everyone does not negate the theory of reincarnation. So long as it happens to a significant number and verified scientifically through modern research, proves the theory. Did you read the article?
shivaathervedi wrote: You wrote," Ginans are allegorical.....", are you not opening a Pandora's Box.

Are Dus Avtars, Jugs, Kalaps, Harishchandra, Tara Rani, krishna, Rama, Shiva, are in allegorical forms? Admin help!
One Pir wrote 124,000 and other wrote 180,000 Paigambers, who is correct?
Please don't be annoyed, these figures are from Ginan books.
This is per MSMS's guidance that there can be many meanings for a Ginan. If you consider the figures as only figurative expressions, then there are no problems. However if you consider them literally, then there is a conflict.
shivaathervedi wrote: Regarding your advice, sit in bandagi and experience past life, let me tell you, when I asked missionaries such questions, the reply was same, sit in bandagi and find. I tried and tried result nothing;
KOUN JIYEY GA TERI ZULF KE SAR HONNEY TAK
These experiences cannot be demanded but are given as a gift. But there have been cases of people having the experiences of past lives.

There is a book written by an Ismaili Azmina Suleman who has given a detailed account of her past lives in her NDE (near death experience).
God's principle apply to all human beings without discrimination. Some people recall past life and some do not is against natural laws. Scientific research keep changing. Once they said Aspirin is not good for heart now they say it is must for heart and arteries. Once they said vitamin E and fish oil is harmful to health, now they say it is beneficial for body.

You have right to translate and understand Ginan according to your ideology, so do I. I take the literal meaning and then analyze. Who will decide which meaning or ta'weel is correct. So many meanings so many conflicts.

With respect Azmina's NDE experience is not an example of reincarnation.
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote:God's principle apply to all human beings without discrimination. Some people recall past life and some do not is against natural laws. Scientific research keep changing. Once they said Aspirin is not good for heart now they say it is must for heart and arteries. Once they said vitamin E and fish oil is harmful to health, now they say it is beneficial for body..
Each individual is unique and everyone of us is not born with the same capacities. There is strength in diversity. MSMS says in his Memoirs:

Roumi and Hafiz, the great Persian poets, have told us, each in his different way, that some men are born with such natural spiritual capacities and possibilities of development that they have direct experience of that great love, that all-embracing, all-consuming love, which direct contact with reality gives to the human soil. Hafiz indeed has said that men like Jesus Christ and Muslim mystics like Mansour and Bayezid and others have possessed that spiritual power of the greater love; that any of us, if the Holy Spirit (*) ever present grants us that enlightenment, can, being thus blessed, have the power which Christ had, but that to the overwhelming majority of men this greater love is not a practical possibility.

http://www.ismaili.net/Source/0016b.html
shivaathervedi wrote: With respect Azmina's NDE experience is not an example of reincarnation.
Why not? Have you read the book?
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote: The term BIRTH can not be used for soul. Soul do not take birth. It is a creation of God and exists from primordial time. The soul is ordered by God to adopt a body according to His will.
When soul leaves body after prescribed time can not come back on its own for fulfillment of left over desires.
Even if you don't accept reincarnation, what is the entity that survives death and is reborn in the higher spheres as per MSMS?
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote: The term BIRTH can not be used for soul. Soul do not take birth. It is a creation of God and exists from primordial time. The soul is ordered by God to adopt a body according to His will.
When soul leaves body after prescribed time can not come back on its own for fulfillment of left over desires.
Even if you don't accept reincarnation, what is the entity that survives death and is reborn in the higher spheres as per MSMS?
The NDE ( near death experiences) can not be equated with reincarnation. In NDE case a person is survived and revived in same body still soul staying in body and not left.
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote:God's principle apply to all human beings without discrimination. Some people recall past life and some do not is against natural laws. Scientific research keep changing. Once they said Aspirin is not good for heart now they say it is must for heart and arteries. Once they said vitamin E and fish oil is harmful to health, now they say it is beneficial for body..
Each individual is unique and everyone of us is not born with the same capacities. There is strength in diversity. MSMS says in his Memoirs:

Roumi and Hafiz, the great Persian poets, have told us, each in his different way, that some men are born with such natural spiritual capacities and possibilities of development that they have direct experience of that great love, that all-embracing, all-consuming love, which direct contact with reality gives to the human soil. Hafiz indeed has said that men like Jesus Christ and Muslim mystics like Mansour and Bayezid and others have possessed that spiritual power of the greater love; that any of us, if the Holy Spirit (*) ever present grants us that enlightenment, can, being thus blessed, have the power which Christ had, but that to the overwhelming majority of men this greater love is not a practical possibility.

http://www.ismaili.net/Source/0016b.html
shivaathervedi wrote: With respect Azmina's NDE experience is not an example of reincarnation.
Why not? Have you read the book?
I have not read the book but have read an article about her.

The question is about recalling past. The quotation from Memoirs is not addressing question about past lives but is about immense love with who is above all else. Did Hafiz, Rumi, or Christ mentioned about their previous life stories?
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote:
kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote: The term BIRTH can not be used for soul. Soul do not take birth. It is a creation of God and exists from primordial time. The soul is ordered by God to adopt a body according to His will.
When soul leaves body after prescribed time can not come back on its own for fulfillment of left over desires.
Even if you don't accept reincarnation, what is the entity that survives death and is reborn in the higher spheres as per MSMS?
The NDE ( near death experiences) can not be equated with reincarnation. In NDE case a person is survived and revived in same body still soul staying in body and not left.
I did not ask about NDE here! I asked you what entity survives and is reborn.
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote:I have not read the book but have read an article about her.

The question is about recalling past. The quotation from Memoirs is not addressing question about past lives but is about immense love with who is above all else. Did Hafiz, Rumi, or Christ mentioned about their previous life stories?
I suggest you first read the book and then make comments about the validity of her past life experiences.

It does not matter what the subject matter is, whether it is about direct experience of reality or not. The issue is about people born with different capacities. All of us don't have the same capacity.
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote:
kmaherali wrote:Even if you don't accept reincarnation, what is the entity that survives death and is reborn in the higher spheres as per MSMS?
The NDE ( near death experiences) can not be equated with reincarnation. In NDE case a person is survived and revived in same body still soul staying in body and not left.
I did not ask about NDE here! I asked you what entity survives and is reborn.
Look at the thread, it is about reincarnation in Islam and Islam does not acknowledges reincarnation. Reincarnation is not included in Islamic Tenets. The entities who survive death are still physically in same condition. The soul has not left the body hence there is no question of reborn.
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote:I have not read the book but have read an article about her.

The question is about recalling past. The quotation from Memoirs is not addressing question about past lives but is about immense love with who is above all else. Did Hafiz, Rumi, or Christ mentioned about their previous life stories?
I suggest you first read the book and then make comments about the validity of her past life experiences.

It does not matter what the subject matter is, whether it is about direct experience of reality or not. The issue is about people born with different capacities. All of us don't have the same capacity.
TBH I have no access to this book but I have read about this story. It is true that some people are born with special capabilities but, what capabilities have to do with reincarnation? I am not criticizing her spiritual capabilities but in my view NDE is not equivalent to rebirth or reincarnation because the medium was still alive with same body and soul.

Let me give my personal experience. In my DREAMS I was killed twice, once with bullet wounds and other time in car accident. Both times, I felt some one was dragging me, all of sudden I heard some one said,' LET HIM GO, YET HIS TIME IS NOT UP'. When I woke up from my sleep still I was in my bed.
I figured out it was brain activity or juggling of brain. I was dead but still alive it is not an example of rebirth but it can be NDE.
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote:TBH I have no access to this book but I have read about this story. It is true that some people are born with special capabilities but, what capabilities have to do with reincarnation? I am not criticizing her spiritual capabilities but in my view NDE is not equivalent to rebirth or reincarnation because the medium was still alive with same body and soul..
It has to do with reincarnation because advanced souls have the capacity to transcend the experience of this existence and experience the existences beyond this life. In the NDE experience people experience a 'movie' of their entire life and they are shown where they went wrong or right. Some souls also have the movie of their previous life experiences. Azamina Suleman has given this description in complete details. You need to read the book to understand how this was possible.

NDEs are not dream experiences. There is a vast difference. In dreams your brain is still active and hence dreams are the product of the activity of the brain. In the NDE, the person is pronounced clinically dead and the brain ceases to work. Hence NDEs unlike the dreams are not product of the brain activity.
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Post by shivaathervedi_2 »

kmaherali wrote:
shivaathervedi wrote:TBH I have no access to this book but I have read about this story. It is true that some people are born with special capabilities but, what capabilities have to do with reincarnation? I am not criticizing her spiritual capabilities but in my view NDE is not equivalent to rebirth or reincarnation because the medium was still alive with same body and soul..
It has to do with reincarnation because advanced souls have the capacity to transcend the experience of this existence and experience the existences beyond this life. In the NDE experience people experience a 'movie' of their entire life and they are shown where they went wrong or right. Some souls also have the movie of their previous life experiences. Azamina Suleman has given this description in complete details. You need to read the book to understand how this was possible.

NDEs are not dream experiences. There is a vast difference. In dreams your brain is still active and hence dreams are the product of the activity of the brain. In the NDE, the person is pronounced clinically dead and the brain ceases to work. Hence NDEs unlike the dreams are not product of the brain activity.
You wrote,"In the NDE, the person is pronounced clinically dead and the brain ceases to work". This stage is called a person in comma. Usually in our Tariqa or system Mukhi is requested for mushkil aasan satara and chhanta.
Apart from satara and chhanta, let us look NDE scientifically.

Adopted:
A near-death experience (NDE) is a personal experience associated with death or impending death. Such experiences may encompass a variety of sensations including detachment from the body, feelings of levitation, total serenity, security, warmth, the experience of absolute dissolution, and the presence of a light. NDEs are a recognized part of some transcendental and religious beliefs in an afterlife. Neuroscience research suggests that an NDE is a subjective phenomenon resulting from "disturbed bodily multisensory integration" that occurs during life-threatening events.It was Raymond Moody who in 1975 coined the term "near-death experience".

Researchers have identified the common elements that define near-death experiences. The general features of the experience include impressions of being outside one's physical body, visions of deceased relatives and religious figures, and transcendence of egotic and spatiotemporal boundaries. Many common elements have been reported, although the person's interpretation of these events often corresponds with the cultural, philosophical, or religious beliefs of the person experiencing it.

Common traits that have been reported by NDErs are as follows:

A sense/awareness of being dead.
A sense of peace, well-being and painlessness. Positive emotions. A sense of removal from the world.
An out-of-body experience. A perception of one's body from an outside position, sometimes observing medical professionals performing resuscitation efforts.
A "tunnel experience" or entering a darkness. A sense of moving up, or through, a passageway or staircase.
A rapid movement toward and/or sudden immersion in a powerful light (or "Being of Light") which communicates with the person.
An intense feeling of unconditional love and acceptance.
Encountering "Beings of Light", "Beings dressed in white", or similar. Also, the possibility of being reunited with deceased loved ones.
Receiving a life review, commonly referred to as "seeing one's life flash before one's eyes".
Approaching a border or a decision by oneself or others to return to one's body, often accompanied by a reluctance to return.
Suddenly finding oneself back inside one's body.
Connection to the cultural beliefs held by the individual, which seem to dictate some of the phenomena experienced in the NDE and particularly the later interpretation thereof.

Kenneth Ring (1980) subdivided the NDE on a five-stage continuum.

Peace
Body separation
Entering darkness
Seeing the light
Entering the light

Now look at Azmina's case, it comes under neuroscience.
kmaherali
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Post by kmaherali »

shivaathervedi wrote: Now look at Azmina's case, it comes under neuroscience.
It does not come under neuroscience. She had outside the body perceptions wherein she could view her own body being treated. Whatever you may call it, she had the accurate review of her present life and previous lives. It was real. You need to read the book to grasp the immensity of her experience.
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Post by Admin »

Look at Mowlana Hazar Imam's recent Farman made in Nairobi about each of your lives.

Yes I know the Farman is not accessible so why not ask a copy to whoever runs this restriction?
kmaherali
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Post by kmaherali »

Admin wrote:Look at Mowlana Hazar Imam's recent Farman made in Nairobi about each of your lives.

Yes I know the Farman is not accessible so why not ask a copy to whoever runs this restriction?
Not the correct place for the comment!
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