Safai Tariqah

Post by **Admin** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 7:38 pm

Which are the Imam Murshids you accept before Imam Ismail. I guess you acccept Mowlana Ali and his progeny up to Imam Jafar Sadik also?

a_27826 · Post by **a_27826** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 1:05 pm

zznoor wrote:73 is just rhetorical number used in Quran. It does not mean only 73 sects.

when quoting Quran, it would be nice to quote chapter and verse as well in form of chapter:verse

a_27826 · Post by **a_27826** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 1:10 pm

safaialevi wrote:
a_27826 wrote:so you can have more than one Murshid Imam at a time.

what happens when two or more Murshid Imams contradict each other on some subject ?

In such case who do you follow ?
No, one Murshid Imam at a time, but many through out the history. Before Imam Ismail we accept other Murshid Imams.

so how does the current Ismaili Imam or the past Ismaili Imams leads you to the occulted Twelver Imam ?

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 1:26 pm

73 is just rethoricle number used in Quran. It does not mean only 73 sects

Can you please give me the Ayat # of your above claim?

I think it is in Hadiths not in quran;

The exact Hadith is:_

((My ummah will be divided into seventy three sects. All of them will be in the Fire except one?)), [Saheeh Muslim, no.976]

The above quote told by Prophet Mohd (PBUH) to sahabas that there will be 73 different sects in Islam but there will be only one sect which will get 'NAJAT' the remaining 72 sects will be in vain.

zznoor · Post by **zznoor** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 2:50 pm

I stand corrected
73 is still a rethoricle number used in the Hadith. General meaning is, out of many sects those who follow path laid out by Quran and Authentic Sunnah will be successful.

ShamsB · Post by **ShamsB** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 3:59 pm

zznoor wrote:I stand corrected
73 is still a rethoricle number used in the Hadith. General meaning is, out of many sects those who follow path laid out by Quran and Authentic Sunnah will be successful.

Once again that is your belief that those that will follow the Quran and Authentic Sunnah..will be successful

i don't see that happening...and not my belief.

Shams

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:42 pm

Bahenji,
Kab tak chhupaye rakho ke chehra apna nakab me?

You must heard this idiom it is in Hindi and also in Urdu

"Ek jhuth chhupane ke liye so juth aour bolne padte hai!

i.e there is no ayas on 73 sects!! Period. If there is, then give me that ayas # otnerwise keep your mouth damn shut BTW who care about your foolish theory and weird thinking? atleast not me sister.... t.[/. ] Kahi auor ja ke darwaja kht khataye yaho tumhara koi gaj chalne wala nabi, kya hammo bevkoof samaj rakhha hai?

zznoor · Post by **zznoor** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 6:20 pm

agakhani wrote:Bahenji,
Kab tak chhupaye rakho ke chehra apna nakab me?

You must heard this idiom it is in Hindi and also in Urdu

"Ek jhuth chhupane ke liye so juth aour bolne padte hai!

i.e there is no ayas on 73 sects!! Period. If there is, then give me that ayas # otnerwise keep your mouth damn shut BTW who care about your foolish theory and weird thinking? atleast not me sister.... t.[/. ] Kahi auor ja ke darwaja kht khataye yaho tumhara koi gaj chalne wala nabi, kya hammo bevkoof samaj rakhha hai?

I did say I stand corrected. That also means I erred.
It is Hadith and not in Quran

Post by **Admin** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 10:36 pm

Reference to the 72 sects can also be found in Farmans of Imam Aga Ali Shah and Mowlana Shah Karim, the present Imam in Karachi October 2000.

zznoor · Post by **zznoor** » Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:37 am

Admin wrote:Reference to the 72 sects can also be found in Farmans of Imam Aga Ali Shah and Mowlana Shah Karim, the present Imam in Karachi October 2000.

Nobody knows how many sects but there must be more than 72.
To go to Jannah you do not have to belong to sect. You have to follow Quran and guidance of Prophet.

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:42 am

To go to Jannah you do not have to belong to sect. You have to follow Quran and guidance of Prophet.

Which Jannah? which is called heaven also!! if yes then I do not want to go over there because it is 'A STABLE OF HORSE' as per SMS. but I want salvation ( Moksha as per our pirs) of my soul that way I do not have to come back on this earth again and again.

Post by **Admin** » Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:10 am

Jannah is also a prison for good but ignorant people.

Anything beside becoming one with god is a useless goal. Why aim for the mountain when you can reach the sky?

tret · Post by **tret** » Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:11 pm

Admin wrote:Jannah is also a prison for good but ignorant people.

Anything beside becoming one with god is a useless goal. Why aim for the mountain when you can reach the sky?

Couldn't agree more!

I can't recall where I read this, but it's beautiful.

Those who belong to this[temporal] world, don't belong to other[Akherat] world. Those who belong to other world, don't belong to this[temporal] world.
Those who belong to Allah-tahala, don't belong[need] to neither!

zznoor · Post by **zznoor** » Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:35 pm

agakhani wrote:
To go to Jannah you do not have to belong to sect. You have to follow Quran and guidance of Prophet.
Which Jannah? which is called heaven also!! if yes then I do not want to go over there because it is 'A STABLE OF HORSE' as per SMS. but I want salvation ( Moksha as per our pirs) of my soul that way I do not have to come back on this earth again and again.

Fortunately Islam does not teach reincarnation.
Yes we had debate about it and let's agree to disagree regarding reincarnation.
I whis you best nd you achieve Mox.

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Tue Mar 18, 2014 1:47 pm

Fortunately Islam does not teach reincarnation.

It is a pity for those who can not understand clear quoted ayas in Quran on reincarnation, I feel sorry about those guys.

Second:-

Don't blame Islam for wrong interpretation already made by Mullah and Molwis or translators; that there is no reincarnation in Islam! it is totally wrong interpretation, now a days even science also has started to accept reincarnation belief, scientists have many proof for life after death!!.
I can suggest you as many books you like in reincarnation of well known authors, would you like to read it!??

BTW :- Quran teach us about reincarnation, there are 26-27 ayas in Quran which directly point out about reincarnation!! only thing you need to do is forget what Mullah and Molwis says about reincarnation in past but open your eyes and read Quran one more time by your self and I am pretty sure that you will change your mind after read it

zznoor · Post by **zznoor** » Tue Mar 18, 2014 2:03 pm

agakhani wrote:
Fortunately Islam does not teach reincarnation.
It is a pity for those who can not understand clear quoted ayas in Quran on reincarnation, I feel sorry about those guys.

Second:-

Don't blame Islam for wrong interpretation already made by Mullah and Molwis or translators; that there is no reincarnation in Islam! it is totally wrong interpretation, now a days even science also has started to accept reincarnation belief, scientists have many proof for life after death!!.
I can suggest you as many books you like in reincarnation of well known authors, would you like to read it!??

BTW :- Quran teach us about reincarnation, there are 26-27 ayas in Quran which directly point out about reincarnation!! only thing you need to do is forget what Mullah and Molwis says about reincarnation in past but open your eyes and read Quran one more time by your self and I am pretty sure that you will change your mind after read it

You did not read this so read it again

Yes we had debate about it and let's agree to disagree regarding reincarnation
I wish you best and hope you achieve Mox..

a_27826 · Post by **a_27826** » Tue Mar 18, 2014 2:40 pm

Lets get back to Safai Tariqa.

I hope Safaialevi is still here.

What does Safai Tariqa say about a soul having many cycles of life ?

safaialevi · Post by **safaialevi** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:11 pm

Admin wrote:Which are the Imam Murshids you accept before Imam Ismail. I guess you acccept Mowlana Ali and his progeny up to Imam Jafar Sadik also?

There was three: Mohammad ibn Hannafiya, Zayd ibn Ali, and Mohammed Nafs Zakkiya.

a_27826 wrote:
safaialevi wrote:
a_27826 wrote:so you can have more than one Murshid Imam at a time.

what happens when two or more Murshid Imams contradict each other on some subject ?

In such case who do you follow ?
No, one Murshid Imam at a time, but many through out the history. Before Imam Ismail we accept other Murshid Imams.
so how does the current Ismaili Imam or the past Ismaili Imams leads you to the occulted Twelver Imam ?

We have different view for the history, which lead our community later to a different views on many doctrines, which are syncretic, because Safa'i start to organize near the 16th century, and influenced by the small movement which tried to unite Ismailis and Alawites beleifs in Syria in the 14th century.

a_27826 wrote:Lets get back to Safai Tariqa.

I hope Safaialevi is still here.

What does Safai Tariqa say about a soul having many cycles of life ?

We believe that death is natural process no thing disappear but everything in the material and spiritual world is part of process of changing and evolving.